interest question - what do kids do at pre school in the UK?

**jamsplat** · 17-05-2012, 05:41pm

inspired by the starting school at 6 thread

I've been hearing lots of places that kids 'outgrow' pre school and need the extra stimulation of reception or words to that effect, and that got me wondering what the differences are between pre school in the UK and norwegian kindergartens (where kids leave to start school between 5 years 8 months and 6 years 8 months)

The typical sort of things my kids do at kindergarten are
'circle time' (stories, language/maths games, songs etc.)
free play inside (lego, jigsaws, board games, figures, dolls etc.)
free play outside (sand, water, play equipment, cycles etc),
art and crafty stuff (painting, beading, sewing, weaving, drawing, clay modelling, wood work etc.)
music (singing, percussion instruments),
drama,
cooking,
outdoor trips/hiking (from 3 years) (forest, lake, sea, hills etc. campfire cooking)

To be honest most of the time is free play either in or out there is relatively little directed activity, circle time everyday and an outdoor trip once a week for those 3 +, but the kids don't seem to be bored, so I was wondering is this very different from a UK pre school?

**helpimfalling** · 17-05-2012, 05:51pm

Mine today 4 and 3 done water and sand and drawing and glueing snack time and stories Tap a shape, made some muffins and watched Dora the explora there are normally four tables set up with different activities! They go to a private nursery that take children from 0 till five and have tea there there are two classes I think over three and under three

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**bubblewrap** · 17-05-2012, 05:56pm

Pre-schools vary throughout the UK. For example, from what I've figured out, our pre-school seems to be very similar to the England-based 'reception'. Pretty much what you've listed apart from the outdoor trips/hiking, and I don't think they do much in the way of cooking. Most of them also learn number/letter/shape recognition etc before starting school between 4.5 and 5.5 years.

Oh, and our pre-school sessions are 2.5 hours a day, not the full school hours.

**scatterbrain** · 17-05-2012, 06:00pm

Sounds pretty similar, although there are also tables of organised activities (the children to can choose to take part in). Things like junk modelling, puzzles, painting, sorting, play doh etc are usually on the tables & the teachers/helpers will usually be sitting at the tables and help the children. The children can of course also choose to go off & dress up or get building blocks out or draw pictures etc. They also have a computer for supervised educational games. Apart from story time and circle time it's usually up to the child what they do.

There are set objectives, though, and the teachers do have to ensure the children work towards certain levels. I can't go into a huge amount of detail as it's ages since I looked in Abi's folder, but it includes getting them ready for starting school - like social development (playing well with others etc), understanding colours/shapes, counting, pencil control through colouring etc etc. I'm sure there's more to it, but that's how I as a parent see it. Abi is getting on really well with her adding & subtracting so I think she has been working on that (through play on one of the tables I think). They also introduce letters & reading by getting them to recognise & copy letters in their name. When Elena was that age and at private nursery she also learned all her letters and started reading basic words. But the school nursery don't as that's what they start doing in term 1 of reception.

Both of my girls are keen to learn and at that age love doing letters/colours/numbers/counting etc. It's what they enjoy doing. Abigail will love starting reception in September, just as Elena did.

In school they still have some free play but use the organised table activities to teach them more. So they'll be learning all of their letters, basic reading, counting to 20. It's all done at the level of the child, but by the end of reception the idea is that they can read basic words & write letters. Of course there's more to it than that as they'll also go on nature walks, discuss themes, develop problem solving skills, role play etc.

Abi used to go to a private nursery locally where they had no organised activity & she hated it. It was all free play & with kids running all over the place & limited interactive supervision. She much prefers the more organised environment in the school nursery.

ETA: pre school is 3 hrs a day. Reception is full days (well 9-3 anyway).

**cheeky_biscuit** · 17-05-2012, 06:22pm

Dd2 is at the school nursery 5x3hours a week.
They have about 5 tables laid out with different activities, a roll play area and the carpet for circle time. Theres always a phonics/letters table where they trace letters and begin to learn phonics. I have noticed it's very focused on the individual child and dd is in a phonics group with 1 other child only, as they are considered on an equal footing. Some of the other children are in groups of 5. They rotate through the activities, play outside, paint, grow seeds and make an amazing amount of "kites" (paper with wool). She loves it there, she loves her teachers, she has a lot of freedom. She makes books, she goes to the big school for assembly and for IT (she comes home and tells me to go on google) I know I've turned into a big hippy but I'm concerned that when she goes to school the increase in structure will stifle her (i know this sounds wanky).

**cheeky_biscuit** · 17-05-2012, 06:29pm

This covers what they're meant to be at by the time they're 5 - I think the EYFS covers them until KS1 (yr1, age 5-6)
http://media.education.gov.uk/assets...rch%202012.pdf

**Cerise** · 17-05-2012, 06:43pm

If I were being blunt then I don't think children do outgrow a half decent pre-school. I think the problem is that as children go to pre-school younger and younger the'nearly ready for school' children mix with more and more 2 year olds so naturally they have different interests and capabilities. So the need isn't to go to school, but to make sure that the pre-school covers that wide range of ages if that is the age of child they are going to admit.

I can get a little bit soap boxy about this. One of the reasons my 4 year old will go to school is because the alternative is being with children just turned 2 and no-one his own age. Mixed age is great, but all the other 4 year olds will be at school so he would be very much the odd one out. The activities at his pre-school are very varied and there is certainly no reason for him to outgrow them.

But then I don't see school as being the place for children to learn. They learn through everyday life and the things that they do with me. They learn letters through talking about the signs on shops and numbers by counting the stairs as you walk up them. School just gets in the way of all the learning, but gives them a nice chance to socialise and learn other skills that way.

**Booh** · 17-05-2012, 07:04pm

Every child (or baby) who is in a nursery / pre school / childminder and reception year at school follows the EYFS, after that they move on the formal education Key stage 1.

Its really what you described TBH, as I do all of those things as a childminder and far more!

**cheeky_biscuit** · 17-05-2012, 07:23pm

I think I may have used the "she's ready for school" phrase about dd1 before she started school. But really she was just a bit bored in the private nursery setting. I was in such a hurry to get her reading & writing which I regret now. Thankfully she seems ok about it but I wish I'd let her be 4 for longer.

**Bananatree** · 17-05-2012, 07:29pm

What Booh said.
Every preschool has to follow the Early Years Foundation Satge Curriculum and use it to plan activities and assess children to help them move on. What you describe is normal, they will continually assess children to ensure they are learning and adapt the environment as needed.
It is very play based and learning is done through the child, not through the teacher.

**Bluebabe75** · 17-05-2012, 07:32pm

Em is in the youngest pre-school room at nursery (she is 2). They also have a room for 3 year olds and a room for 4 year olds. The 4 year olds room is in an annexe and separate from the younger ones, and I think the activities are more like school nursery. They are not with the younger ones, although there is some integration between Em's room and the next age group up.

Em does craft activities (painting, drawing, collage), messy play, indoor and outdoor free play, Monkey music, circle time, soft play...

**Duckie** · 17-05-2012, 07:39pm

Mine go (went) to a private Montessori preschool which is absolutely lovely, and even at just about 5 when she started school there is no way Anna had 'out-grown' it. She was ready for school, I felt, in terms of emotional maturity but in terms of the variety of activities and experiences offered at preschool she could have stayed there a lot longer.

This week at preschool, Elliot has made honey biscuits as they're learning about the life-cycle of bees and watched the Very Hungry Caterpillar, related to learning about butterflies. He plays outside every day when it's dry and in the rain as long as it's not absolutely chucking it down. He does activities related to learning how to look after himself such as laying the table, polishing, buckling belts, threading activities, number activities and phonics. He has circle time with stories and songs every day too. I don't really know exactly what he does as he normally 'forgets' every time I ask him but I know he's busy all day as he's usually exhausted afterwards

. I don't feel he's ready for school yet as he's very young for the year so have deferred his place until after Xmas but there will be plenty of other children about the same age still there as the headmistress actively discourages children starting school until they're ready for it, and believes that at just turned four they're too young.

ETA. Just reread my post and remembered other stuff he does, eg. painting, chalking, writing practice, planting seeds, they've got a vegetable patch which they'll be working on soon too. They also go on nature walks and look for bugs etc., use the computer sometimes and group activities such as cooking, games, songs etc.

**scatterbrain** · 17-05-2012, 09:18pm

oh yes, Abi does cooking & planting seeds & they have discussion topics on a Friday. I think it's the smaller groups & organised activities that the children can choose from and are designed to develop them that makes a school nursery different from *some* other nurseries. I only have experience of two - one was very good & seperated the older children out into smaller groups & seemed to care about how they were developing & the other just had loads of kids running around making lots of noise & no organised activities at all. Abi prefers the more 'structured' environment, although in terms of structure it's all still play based and they choose what activities they want to take part in.

**Mrs B** · 17-05-2012, 09:27pm

DD goes to the preschool attached to the primary school her brother goes to; it has a pretty similar set-up to what most others have mentioned here.

I love it because it's predominantly free-play (which I feel it should be at age 3) but they have some structure in place like registration, group carpet activities, story-time, waiting on the mat til they are collected etc. Gives them a flavour of what is coming next year, so makes for an easy transition. The Reception teacher comes in several times a week too, so they'll know their teacher when they start school proper.

**jamsplat** · 17-05-2012, 09:55pm

Thank you for all your replies, it sounds like basically they are all doing the same sorts of things

I did ask dd2 (4) what her favourite thing at kindergarten was and she thought for a while and said 'when the fire alarm went off and the fire engine came'

guess you can't beat that.

There does seem to be less emphasis on formal pre reading and writing skills here, the view seems to be that schools work with their intake at whatever level they are at, and obviously given they start school relatively late its not unusual for them to be reading and writing before school. They do have '5 year olds club' for the kids the year before they start school but that seems to be more about helping them mature than any academic focus, with activities including going to the forest and chopping wood

Its also fair to say that although there's alot of free play there is also a fairly high density of staff so not so much of the running round chaos, at least not inside. Last time I stopped in for coffee for example there were 3/4 kids using hama beads and one of the teachers was sitting with them and there was a discussion about colour and pattern going on, 2 girls were playing a memory game with one of the staff, there was a gang on the sofa listening to a story, a couple of them were playing with a floor puzzle, and some of them were playing with playdough.

**scatterbrain** · 17-05-2012, 10:04pm

It actually sounds pretty similar then.

**cheeky_biscuit** · 17-05-2012, 10:08pm

Its interesting to get a view of education from a different country for me.
If you're interested the girls experienced a Daycare/school in Penang Malaysia about this time last year. They went for 2.5wks (well dd2 prob did 5days altogether) Dd1 (6)went in the 6yr olds room with about 5 other 6 yr olds and one teacher, dd2 (3.5) went in the daycare room with 2 & 3yr olds at my request. 99% of the students were Chinese Malay. A typical day
8:30am rice porridge for breakfast
9:00 National anthem - all children together, standing to attention singing in Malaysian
9:05 off to lessons. For dd1 this was 3 hours of sitting at a desk doing worksheet activities. Everything was taught in English with the exception of bahasa Malay for 30-60mins.
Dd2 learnt how to hold a pencil correctly and colour in lines - if she went out of the lines she would have to start again.
They did a science project in the 6's class where try filtered water though stones/grit/soil.
12:00 lunch time (chopsticks!)
12:30 shower time!!!! But this was no Uk shower it was a wash with a pan of water over the head (dd2 opted out, it was dd1s favourite part of the day)
Until 2pm free play (garden & inside - films in English to enhance their language development).
They also used the cane and sent home tonnes of homework from 4yrs old. A lot of the children had additional lessons at an after school place (my 2 did art classes so I saw the others doing maths/English etc).
It was a huge eye opener for all of us, it would definitely not have been a long term option for me.