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  1. #1
    Damsel Diva creamcracker
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    :-( G has lost an ounce. Not sure if I can carry on.

    As the title says really. I'm in tears. I've struggled over the weekend with blocked ducts but Gwen has been so awake and alert I thought she must be feeding ok. HV weighed her this morning and shes lost an ounce. I'm gutted.
    Im sat waiting to see the regional bf support lady. Why am I so determined to do this at the possible detriment of my daughter? DH wants me to switch to bottles and I'm starting to cave.
    SOrry for the brain dump, no reply needed, just needed to get it out.



  2. #2
    Cc

    We are having weight issues too - 5 1/2 weeks Ella has gained 7oz in total

    I'm just home from a 3 night stay in hospital - during that time Ella went from 8lb 7 to 8lb 4 and we are home and she is 8lb 5

    Similar to g Ella has oral thrush.this really affected her feeding she was snacking as a result so getting too much watery milk (nappies signified this as well as weight troubles) and was also very sleepy (reason for hospital trip)
    I was having to wake for feeds (still am)

    Last Wednesday with hv we decided to introduce 2 formula feeds the rest breast as we'll as use daktarin gel

    I have seen and spoken to all manner of people in last few days and now so I know quantities in fully expressing and giving ebm and formula on alternate feeds

    I know with me it is not a supply issue as did the exclusive expressing with ds and got 9oz this morning so with Ella she just wasn't feeding well enough on me

    Has anything like this been suggested?

    Disclaimer : I am not advising cc to do the same unless on guidance of her hv etc but as we are having similar troubles thought this may be useful to share












    baby max born 14.4.2010,mmc 6.12.2007,mmc 11.06.2008, mc 25.11.2008

  3. #3
    Super fit Damsel Velvet Chain
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    Re: :-( G has lost an ounce. Not sure if I can carry on.

    I don't have an answer, but just wanted to say that *if* you have to bottle feed your child - it is not the end of the world. I had to bottle feed DS as I just couldn't breast feed (totally blocked ducts, only found a few years later when having a scan for a breast lump).

  4. #4
    Damsel Diva creamcracker
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    Re: :-( G has lost an ounce. Not sure if I can carry on.

    She does have one bottle a day and we are using the gel. Up until today she has been gaining, all be it slowly. When I express I sometimes get up to 3 oz but very often it's 1. She feeds constantly ( feels like that anyway!) but we do get lots of wet and dirty nappies plus she is alert and awake lots in the day. This will be the second bf councillor to see us so I'm hoping today will give us some answers. I feel it's a latch issue. She nipple feeds although I'm not sore.

    Why is this so hard and why do I care so much! DD1 thrived on formula and expressed milk so what's my obsession? Gahhhhhh!

  5. #5

    Re: :-( G has lost an ounce. Not sure if I can carry on.

    How often are you weighing? If it's weekly it's too frequent to show true weight gain- like an adult weighing themselves every day.

    It could be scales need calibrating, or a different set of scales, or a wee beforehand, or a different nappy, or a poo last night. An oz is such a tiny amount

    You say she's happy and alert, and you think she's feeding well. Stick with that rather than the numbers.

    I was the same, totally determined to bf, even through the weight "problems". I'd been seeing a locum HV who insisted on weighing every week, when I saw "my" HV, he immediately stopped weighing her, which solved most of the problems . We went on her "look", hydration, wee, poo, instead, and weighed monthly. Her gain was still very slow, but you could see it was an overall gain.

    It's not to the detriment of your baby, honestly. Formula may artificially speed up her weight gain, but that's not necessarily the best thing for her- it's just keeping the HV happy. *IF* she does have some sort of health issue, those issues would still be there on formula, so it won't fix anything.

    I know it takes quite a bit of conviction if it's your first bf baby, but you can refuse to weigh as often. Some bf babies do gain very slowly, then have a huge growth spurt- I've said before my DD's chart looks like a staircase!

    What I did was accept the referral to paeds for slow gain. They tested for thyroid and the main metabolic diseases, and checked development, so that helped my confidence there was nothing wrong. They all agreed I should carry on bf if I could, and formula wouldn't help.

    It's so hard, but you wouldn't believe how many people go through this. 7 years ago when I was, there were half a dozen people on here going through the same thing, and that kept me going.

  6. #6
    Damsel Diva claireh
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    Re: :-( G has lost an ounce. Not sure if I can carry on.

    IME babies don't gain consistently. My daughter especially used to gain in fits and starts.

    I may be wrong but I don't think a loss of an ounce is that much. If you factor in different scales and your lo doing a big poo or wee then I don't think I would be worrying yet.

    Are you eating ok? Do you like oaty cereal bars or flapjacks? Could you try to eat one 2 or 3 times a day? I found them great for upping my supply. Glasses of water are a pain but for some reason I would drink more from sports cap bottles of water.

    If your baby is alert, happy then I would be tempted to stick with bf a while longer. You could always offer a top up of formula after a full breastfeeding (after offering both sides). I had to do this for a while (couple of weeks) when my supply went AWOL when I moved house when M was six weeks old. After a few weeks I didn't need to do the top ups anymore.

    SMA do teeny glass bottles of ready made formula and teats. I only topped up a couple of feeds per day but they really helped until my supply sorted itself out.

    Eta not saying you have a supply problem btw. A supply problem is pretty unusual as I understand it.

    Hang in there. Xxx

  7. #7

    Re: :-( G has lost an ounce. Not sure if I can carry on.

    Whatever you decide to do will be the right for you - nobody can make that decision for you. What helped me when feeding Dd2 was when she was snacking I made sure she started the next feed on the breast that she had last had to make sure she got enough hind milk.
    How does the latest weight loss compare to what has happened in previous weeks? Unless there has been a constant loss or she is very small one ounce isn't a major loss. Was she weighed on exactly the same set of scales?
    I hope you get things sorted

  8. #8
    Doughty Damsel diamond301
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    Re: :-( G has lost an ounce. Not sure if I can carry on.

    Hi CC

    S was a slow gainer, she weighed 7lb 5 at birth, she's now 27 months and only just hit 22lbs and off the bottom of the charts, she did at one point lose weight but i refused to FF as i knew she was healthy, happy alert, weeing etc and meeting all the milestones i would expect her to (some quicker than C did and others slower than C).

    I found with S she tended to put a pound on every couple of months (where as C put a pound on every month), that is just her make up, even now she eats like a horse but doesn't really gain anything. I was always spurred on that she had gained weight, no matter how small, a gain was a gain.

    I hope your meeting goes well
    Callum (2008)

    Sienna (2010)



  9. #9

    Re: :-( G has lost an ounce. Not sure if I can carry on.

    I feel for you, I really do. Its such a difficult thing to decide and it feels like it all falls on your shoulders. I suppose one positive thing is that if you decide to change to bottle, you have your husbands support.

    I think when you give birth they must inject you with some "I shall breastfeed no matter what" serum, as I felt exactly the same and felt like a total failure for even considering bottles. I had thrush and it was soooo painful and I dreaded feeding her. After 5 weeks, I changed to bottles and it was the best thing I did. It took me another 2 weeks to stop as I had so much milk and did it very slowly.......so total of 7 weeks, which I'm now pleased I managed, but I never looked back after bottles, she was happier and more settled, I was in no pain and happier and DH could join in.

    You've fed her really well so far so speak to the BF lady and see if she can help you, get as much support as possible and give yourself time to make the decision.

  10. #10
    Invisable Chell
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    Like Faith said, my DD had slow weight gain (10lb 5 at 6mths old). She was always happy and content yet my Hv/GP were convinced there was an issue.

    One thing I tried was to express then feed that milk to her. Bottle feeding is supposed to be less tiring then breast feeding.

    Has she had her urine tested? They can give you a little bag to catch the wee in the nappy. Apparently an infection can cause weight loss. The body is putting all the energy into fighting the infection.

    Do what you think is best. Do your research and decide what you want to do. Medical professionals seem to think that formula and early weaning is the answer to everything!
    DS July 2003, DD1 January 2005, DD2 August 2008

  11. #11
    Damsel Diva Bert2e
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    Re: :-( G has lost an ounce. Not sure if I can carry on.

    Have you looked at the section on Kellymom about increasing weight gain?

    http://kellymom.com/health/growth/weight-gain_increase/



  12. #12

    Re: :-( G has lost an ounce. Not sure if I can carry on.

    Ok, one thing I realised with both of my babies is to sustain their milk I had to eat ALOT of food! Now I'm not telling you to stuff your face with rubbish just make sure you eat and drink plenty. After each feed try and express of each boob, at first you probably won't get any but you are sending signals to your body to make more milk.

    Put her to the breast as much as possible. Also, what are you and your Husband's build like? if your small she may well just be following her natural
    curve.

    How do you think she is? is she happy, content, wet and dirty nappies? This is SO much more important than a scale.

    I know someone said it was supposed to be easier for babies to bottle feed but I just don't think that's true, I saw a bf adviser with my first and she said that it Bf is so much easier as the let-down is like a tap turning on and it pours down there throat.

    Whatever you decide only YOU know what's best for your daughter and you're doing a great job



  13. #13
    Weeble emgem
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    Re: :-( G has lost an ounce. Not sure if I can carry on.

    I couldn't read this and not post, you sound so sad

    I've been exactly where you are and so have many more on here. We know how hard it is when things don't go to plan so keep on brain dumping.

    I'm not going to post a load of advice about supply and weight gain etc etc as you've had fab advice already.

    But what I will say is, from experience, you need to make a decision. Either do as Faith did and go by if your baby is happy, alert, weeing lots and having dirty names which are all good signs they are nutrionally ok. And then stop weighing her or at least drop it to once every 3/4 weeks.

    Or think you've given it a good shot at bf'ing but you can bring yourself to formula feed her and make your peace with it.

    I promise once you have an action plan in mind and stick to it you will feel much better. These newborn baby days pass so quickly and to spend them in despair and upset like you are is so sad.

    I've been just where you are as I said before, tears rolling down my face because my DD had only gained half of what she should have done and the HV was threatening to get her admitted to hospital and put on a drip if I didn't top her up with formula. I put myself under immense pressure to bf and I was doing well at it but because DD didn't follow a line they labelled her as "failing to thrive" which made me feel like a complete failure.

    For the record too my dinky little lady is now 7, bright as a button but still very petite. She weighs four pounds more than her younger brother (3.5 yr gap) and is still wearing age 4-5 clothes. Thats just her build.

    I hope you can come to a decision that you feel happy with
    Emgem xxx





    64 Pounds Lost NO Pounds to go

  14. #14

    Re: :-( G has lost an ounce. Not sure if I can carry on.

    Quote Originally Posted by emgem View Post
    tears rolling down my face because my DD had only gained half of what she should have done and the HV was threatening to get her admitted to hospital and put on a drip if I didn't top her up with formula. I put myself under immense pressure to bf and I was doing well at it but because DD didn't follow a line they labelled her as "failing to thrive" which made me feel like a complete failure.
    It's unsurprising really that breastfeeding rates are so low in this country, when the sole focus is on weight, charts, and comparison to formula fed babies. Especially when the solution to every hiccup is formula. I am astounded at how uniniformed people are , including health professionals- who are usually the worst as they are professing their ignorance from a place of power, and you need to be really strong willed to go against a so called expert. Threatening a drip because a baby doesn't gain x amount of weight is bullying, and makes me really angry.

    From Day 1 in hospital I was given a row for not bringing formula with me, and I was constantly asked if I wanted someone to go and get a bottle, to "give myself a break". Yes she fed constantly, but no-one ever told me that was normal. All the time I breastfed people asked me when I was going to stop, hadn't I done enough. When she cried, or wanted feeding again, I was told maybe my milk wasn't rich enough, and maybe she'd be better on a bottle. I should top up, give a bottle in the evening, have a break..

    I got pretty pissed off in the end, and just wanted to shout "I want to breastfeed, my baby is healthy, we are doing fine, I don't want or need a break, and I don't want to give formula. Her feeding habits are normal, weight gain is normal, and not sleeping through is normal. So go away".

    I also got pretty pissed off with all the people who would comment on the breastfeeding, and then give me some half assed reason on why they couldn't. Stuff like you can't breastfeed a baby if they're over 10 lbs, or if they don't sleep through by 6 weeks you have a supply problem, or if they need feeding more frequently than 3 hourly you have a supply problem.

    If your baby is healthy, using your brains rather than a scale, and you want to stick with it, stick with it

    /rant

  15. #15
    Damsel Diva creamcracker
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    Re: :-( G has lost an ounce. Not sure if I can carry on.

    Thank you all so much for your replies and support . I really don't know what I would do without Damsels!
    I got myself worked up in to such a state earlier that I couldn't see the wood for the trees. I'm a very anxious person anyway but pregnancy and the newborn stage make me go loopy !

    Anyway, I saw the lovely BF councillor today who reassured me and showed me some techniques for improving G's feeding. Basically G hasn't been latched properly so has been struggling to get what she needs. She sat with me and showed me biological nursing positions and straight away you could hear G gulping where she had mouthfuls of milk .
    My plan is to persevere until Thursday weigh in and go from there. If it's static or a loss we'll introduce another bottle. I'm going to try and stay relaxed about the whole thing and focus on G as she is happy as larry! My HV is lovely and supportive and isn't overly worried yet so hopefully it's not quite the end just yet.

    Berte2, I'll have a read of the link later, thank you!

    It's good to hear from you about your LO's who are petite etc and were slow gainers as I believe this is how our little lady will be. I'm petite myself and my mum said I was exactly like Gwen so I guess it makes sense.

    Thank you all again so much.

  16. #16

    Re: :-( G has lost an ounce. Not sure if I can carry on.

    Quote Originally Posted by creamcracker View Post

    My plan is to persevere until Thursday weigh in and go from there.
    Are you weighing twice a week? Seriously that is wrong, wrong, wrong, and no way will she have gained enough to register on the scales. Even if she has gained you will need incredibly accurate scales just to overcome user error and inbuilt standard error on these type of scales.

    Weighing that regularly will lead to madness. You will not see a meaningful gain that way. It needs to be minimum bi-weekly. Don't put yourself through it.

    OK. If you don't have the self-confidence to just not go, my plan of action in this situation would be to ask your HV what the point of stressing you out like this is. Tell her it's going to be a vicious circle, stress is going to affect your successful breastfeeding. Ask her exactly how much she expects your baby to put on in 3 days, and ask her when she last calibrated the scales, and could the difference, gain or loss, be accounted for by simple standard error (The answer is yes- just think about weighing an oz of flour on your home scales, it's that accurate )

    If she objects, and insists on twice weekly weighing, ask her what exactly is she looking for, and if she's that worried about your DD's weight gain, isn't it time for a paediatric referral? Then I'd refuse to see her again until I'd seen a GP or paediatrician, who can explain exactly what they are hoping to diagnose, and do the appropriate tests.

    If she hasn't gained why do they think formula is the answer? What exactly is magic about formula that will overcome any sort of real medical issue?

    Honestly creamcracker, nothing you do will help if you weigh twice a week. It doesn't matter how often she feeds, or her latch, a bf baby will just not gain enough in 3 days. I doubt a FF baby would either, but I'm willing to bet no-one has every suggested a FF baby be weighed that often.

    Sheesh. See my earlier post. I am cross again now.

  17. #17

    Re: :-( G has lost an ounce. Not sure if I can carry on.

    I have no experience whatsoever, but you seemed so upset earlier, so just wanted to send a hug. You seem a bit more positive during your last post, and you sound like you're doing a great job. Our bodies fluctuate in weight and I'm sure that's similar for babies, so although it's important to monitor, please don't take this as the only indicator of how well G is feeding.

    ETA: I do agree with Faith that weighing twice a week does seem excessive.
    Last edited by sticky_honey87; 30-04-2012 at 10:08pm.
    sticky_honey87

  18. #18
    Ignoring the rain LibertyGal72
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    Re: :-( G has lost an ounce. Not sure if I can carry on.

    Oh honey I've absolutely no advice but needed to give you a squeeze.
    libertygal


    Kathy Lette: ...women are each other's human Wonderbras uplifting, supportive and making each other look bigger and better.

  19. #19
    Damsel Diva
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    Re: :-( G has lost an ounce. Not sure if I can carry on.

    couldn't read and not post.
    Glad your session with the bf counsellor went well. Agree with faith about the twice weekly weigh ins. Dd1 was about15-16wks when a temp HV put her on weekly weigh ins, when her regular HV came back she was shocked we'd been put on weeklys as "there is clearly nothing wrong here, look how happy she is!".

  20. #20

    Re: :-( G has lost an ounce. Not sure if I can carry on.

    Weighing twice a week is madness, I had a similar issue with W. I knew there was nothing wrong he was alert had plenty of wet and dirty nappies just didn't put on weight at any speed. I had a health visitor trying to tell me that although he was my 4th bf child I should considered switching to formula as I was older now (31) and the quality of my milk may not be as good as the it was the other 3 times. After that day I refused to have him weighed anymore and he is and as always been fine, he just does not put on weight at any speed.
    If she is having wet and dirty nappies(not green) and is alert and has periods of being awake I really wouldn't be concerned about a small loss. I would stop weighing at such short intervals, only weigh once a month unless you have any other reasons to be concerned.

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